12 Gauge 32" VR 'Custom Built'

[budrichard]

This gun is engraved 'Custom Built By Winchester' on the rib and is a flat side 12 Gauge 2&3/4", 32" VR choked IM/FULL. It has a Monte Carlo stock with shadow line cheek piece, a rare combination of features. The fore arm is not standard trap lenght but shorter and I believe it is the elusive 'Hession' style. The lineage has been lost as there is no Cody record of this gun serial # 33412 but I believe it may have been built as a live pigeon gun from its attributes. Tony Galazan has personally examined this gun and indicated as some have suggested that it was not manufactured by him. All who have examined it concur that it is factory original. The figure in the stock is outstanding.

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f82/budrichard/21woodA.jpg

[rperlichek]

Very beautiful gun indeed. Any chance of posting a picture of the forearm?
Also how much does it weigh?

[budrichard]

Gun weighs 8#'s 2.9oz.
It was sold to me as a 'Trap' gun but the forearm is shprter than the standard 'Trap' forearm. It fits the dimensions of the fabled 'Hession' forearm and is equivalent to what Winchester later termed the 'Field' beavertail.
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f82/budrichard/21Forearms.jpg

Forearm's from top to bottom:
16 gauge SKEET 26" barrels
32" Duck 1950's vintage
12 gauge 32" VR 'Custom Built'
20 gauge 26" 3" 'Custom Grade'

As one can see the 32" 'Custom Built' forearm is significantly shorter than the 'Duck' which is about the size of a standard 'Trap' forearm. My conclusion is that the gun was built as a Live Pigeon gun because it meets the attributes.
BTW oncle you use the shorter beavertail I don't think one would go back to the long 'Trap' style.-Dick

[rperlichek]

Thanks for the details on the forearms, as I understand it (from Schwing) the "kidney-style" checkering pattern on the production-era guns pretty much stopped being done in 1950. Do you find this to be the case? Is your
16ga. "skeet" pre-1950? Also the Ebony inlay in the end of the later checkering style forearms-- was this a "special" ? - I see you have 2 of those.
Can you post the dimensions of the inlay on the 12ga. 32.0" VR Custom Built?
Thanks -- B.P.

[budrichard]

Thanks for the details on the forearms, as I understand it (from Schwing) the "kidney-style" checkering pattern on the production-era guns pretty much stopped being done in 1950. Do you find this to be the case? Is your
16ga. "skeet" pre-1950? Also the Ebony inlay in the end of the later checkering style forearms-- was this a "special" ? - I see you have 2 of those.
Can you post the dimensions of the inlay on the 12ga. 32.0" VR Custom Built?
Thanks -- B.P.


Top forearm is a Pre-War Model 21 in the 'kidney-style' which was for the most part in the early production era but Winchester would put any pattern you wanted at any period, so a later Model 21 with the 'kidney-style' would not be out of the question.
Ebony inlay was a feature of 'Custom Built' and 'Custom Grade' Model 21's.
'Custom Built' Model 21's were ordered before the 1960 Custom Shop was established and 'Custom Grade' was one of the three Model 21's available from the Custom Shop. Both have 'Custom Built By Winchster for.........' on the rib. The 'for.........' was optional.
Can't Post dimensions of the inlay as CSMC now owns the gun! I will look for notes on lenght of the forearms and Post when I find the dimensions.-Dick

[rperlichek]

It appears that the ebony insert has slight radius at the back end -- not much detail on these in the book. When you have a chance could you measure all dim's on the 16ga. gun? Maybe a person could then "ratio this up" My engraved vent rib 12ga. '21 does not have an original forearm, although it is a very good copy of one. The kidney-style checkering is pretty well duplicated. I would like to have an insert put in when I have the wood refinished. My forare is 11.0" long and 2.35" wide at widest point.
Regards - Bob

[budrichard]

CSMC also got the 16 SKEET in a trade!
Personally I would not have an insert installed in your present forearm. The potential for disaster is there and the cost of a new forearm is not inconsequential. The selection of individuals who can refinish these guns is decreasing and the price increasing.
If your going to invest money in your Model 21, make sure its worth it. Other wise if it already has non factory wood or whatever, just shoot it and pass on to the next guy when your ready to sell.
I have seen too many Model 21's where a lot of money has been invested to try to bring a gun back to looking like factory when it would have been better just to spend the money on a Model 21 in the condition you want.-Dick